Public Policy Class in DC

During the week following Thanksgiving, students from the Public Policy class "The Supreme Court, Public Policy, and the Ethics of Legal Argument & Decision Making" traveled to Washington, D.C., with Rockefeller Center lecturer in Public Policy Julie Kalish.

In three packed days of programming and one cold, early morning lineup on 1st Street, NE, we were able to attend Supreme Court oral arguments; have personalized visits to the Department of Justice, Office of the Attorney General for Washington, D.C., and American Enterprise Institute; and share multiple networking meals with professionals working in law, policy, and government.

Seeing arguments at the Supreme Court was clearly the purpose and highlight of our trip. So, having read and discussed the briefs for McElrath v. Georgia[1] and Wilkinson v. Garland[2], we set off at 4:30 am on Tuesday, November 28, hoping that neither the arcane double jeopardy, nor limited immigration question would draw too big a crowd. It turned out that we arrived just in time: our group of 12 got the very last of the 50 pink tickets handed out among those who had queued up on that cold morning!

9d1a7da0-bb8a-4258-874a-16d3a266e2fa_laura.jpeg

Standing in line for the Supreme Court early in the morning

1284ac2e-1231-4dc7-9d53-94abcd224311_laura.jpeg

Success! Heading in to hear oral arguments at the Supreme Court

And the experience was worth the cold fingers and toes. We had prepared well; students easily followed not only the reasoning of the advocates, but also the origins and implications of the questions coming from the justices. They were able to spot strengths and weaknesses in the advocacy, as well as debate whether there were missed opportunities to address concerns being expressed from the bench. Students were impressed with both the advocates and justices, and remarked on the "nuance – body language, the intonation of the voice, and banter between the judges – that is only noticeable when you watch an argument in person."  Within the majesty of the space, the importance of what we were witnessing escaped no one. Beyond the press and public discourse, we were seeing what it looks like to hold responsibility for the crafting of a nation's laws.

Around this core experience, I had arranged for us to have a handful of other site-based visits that would help weave a broader tapestry of what it looks like to work at the intersections of law and public policy within the courts, federal government, D.C. government, and private think tanks. People were so generous with their time. We were able to have lunch with a federal District Court judge, visit with a deputy assistant attorney general, meet with a whole panel of people at the D.C. Office of Attorney General, and have a deeply thought-provoking conversation with a scholar at the American Enterprise Institute.

Phil Wallach, a senior fellow with the American Enterprise Institute, kicked off these experiences. A separation of powers scholar, Phil had just published a book entitled Why Congress, and was forthcoming in his thoughts about what is hampering our current Congress and in his defense of the institution and its importance within our Constitutional structure. He encouraged us not to think of "being political" as a "bad" thing, but as an indispensable element of a pluralistic society. The most durable change happens, he argued, not via the courts or administrative bodies, but when people "work the political process." For students who had been studying the pending Loper Bright Industries case, which many believe will overturn Chevron and its doctrinally-dictated deference to administrative agencies, it was interesting to hear Phil's belief that if and when Chevron is overturned, a more natural balancing of expertise and power among government branches will develop.

cc8f6a9d-45ee-4799-bba3-617fc921c7e7_laura.jpeg

Phil Wallach, a senior fellow with the American Enterprise Institute, speaks with the students.

"Separation of powers" emerged in other interesting ways during our visit to the D.C. Office of Attorney General, where Jessica Merry Samuels '12 (Appellate Section, Civil Rights Division, Dept. of Justice) moderated a fascinating discussion among three panelists: Megan Browder, deputy attorney general, Legal Counsel Division of D.C. OAG, as well as Jeremy Girton and Marcy Coburn, who both hold assistant attorney general positions in the D.C. Office of the Solicitor General. These attorneys made abstract separation of powers conversation come to life. They gave examples of how questions of law in D.C. both intersect and exist separately from questions handled in (federal) offices "across the street," and how D.C. functions both similarly to and differently from states. The panel of law-school friends also spoke of their decisions to become government lawyers and shared stories from some of their most interesting and personally rewarding cases.

723cc97d-eb03-414e-b419-bd1a3485d8c2_laura.jpeg

Visit to the D.C. Office of Attorney General

Deputy Assistant Attorney General Maggie Goodlander hosted us later that day in the antitrust division of the Department of Justice and echoed some turning point moments in her own career, including clerkships with Justice Stephen Breyer and then-Judge Merrick Garland. Being mentored by these individuals who shared not only her love of the Constitution, but also her commitment to public service solidified her resolve to pursue justice for the common person and the common good. Students who had never thought about antitrust law or the connection between DOJ and how everyday people experience the law in their own lives left feeling inspired by Maggie's work, "open[ing] a door to more possibilities and interests" and seeing pathways to "helping people through anti-trust, access to justice [initiatives], and labor law."

98af022e-ee90-42cb-a04e-da8c0012bc79_laura.jpeg

Meeting with Deputy Assistant Attorney General, Maggie Goodlander at the Department of Justice

We also got to understand more about what life in a federal trial court looks like during our brown-bag lunch with Judge Jia Cobb at the E. Barrett Prettyman U.S. Courthouse. Judge Cobb was appointed to the bench by President Biden and brought with her a background working in the D.C. Public Defender Service and as a partner in a national civil rights firm. She shared insights forged from working on "both sides of the bench" on complex litigation, thoughts on the ways working at a trial court differs from appellate law, and the tensions that exist in trying to ensure that courtrooms and the pathways of justice are open to all. Whether for individuals seeking to right a wrong, or for newly-minted attorneys seeking a clerkship, Judge Cobb is very aware of the gatekeeping role judges can play within the system and tries to keep doors as open as she can.

57ea53d1-005f-4025-8e2e-a970ce2f1c56_laura.jpeg

Meeting with Judge Jia Cobb at the E. Barrett Prettyman U.S. Courthouse

As a wonderful surprise, one of our students on the trip was able to arrange an optional tour of Georgetown Law School through Brad Russo '01, director of admissions, an opportunity that every student decided to take advantage of (nothing to sneeze at when you've started at 4:00AM one day!). For students whose thoughts about law school were being affected deeply by the trip ("This course and this trip informed me of what is possible for a career in law and encouraged me to explore questions I had not yet considered."), this visit helped make law school itself a concrete reality.

1d5e00b9-43f5-462c-a62c-f7af8972bcbb_laura.jpeg

Students toured Georgetown Law

When not "on site", we shared meals with young, accomplished Dartmouth alumni/ae and attorneys who shared their experiences and career advice with our students. From our most recent graduate, Justin Kramer '21, press assistant for U.S. Sen. Alex Padilla, D-Calif.,); to Campbell Haynes '14, an attorney in the antritrust division; to Zoé Friedland '12, Special Litigation Division of the D.C. Public Defender Service; to Peter Davis, an associate with . Latham & Watkins and former clerk to Justice Elena Kagan, all of our guests inspired the students with their achievements, but even more with their humility and encouragement. As one student said, "all of the alums we met with were so down-to-earth and passionate about their job." One of her favorite parts of the trip was "meeting with Peter Davis (whoah! So humble but so, so cool!)" Connecting with Zoé stood out for several students. "Meeting with Zoé was so meaningful to me. She described her career path so modestly," noted one student, while another remarked that "[h]er advice strongly resonated with me—particularly about fostering relationships with people who are both kind and brilliant." Who knows, one day these students might follow in Zoé's footsteps; the latter student saying "her passion for public defense work was inspiring," while the former student "found that in many ways I want to do what she's doing!"

1a164a1c-68a3-4d48-98e2-903b8fb5874b_laura.jpeg

The students had dinner with alumni guests every night

This modesty, passion, openness, and commitment to public service was notable in everyone we met with in D.C. and students couldn't help remarking on that theme throughout the trip. As one student put it, "I was extremely touched by the connection we made with Maggie Goodlander, Zoé Freidland, and Judge Jia Cobb. Each of these folks represented such a calming, personable demeanor, with quiet confidence and gentle humility, that spoke volumes of their character. Not only did we see these folks serving in positions of authority or great influence, but we also got to see how their humanity and ethics factored into their career choices and the way they engage with the law and its disciplines."

These critical connections between law, government, public service, public policy, ethics, and our collective humanism manifested in the physical spaces we visited as well. In our trip to the National Museum of African American History and Culture, our nighttime tour of D.C.'s monuments, our guided tour of the Department of Justice building, our quick drop-in to the Library of Congress, and obviously in the Supreme Court, we were confronted with the magnitude of what it means to be a nation built on a vision of participatory self-government. That enterprise turns on the ethics and responsibility we bring to the task and the city itself is built to remind us of that. As one student put it when speaking of the Department of Justice, "I saw how our country wrestled with the questions of law, justice, and ethics in the very architecture of the building."

29a085ef-8765-41d4-bbd4-c6f476be73c6_laura.jpeg

Visiting the National Museum of African American History and Culture

"The trip was everything I had hoped for," said one of the students. The same was true for me in what I was hoping to accomplish not just with the trip, but with the course. The law is a tool crafted by human beings to serve human ends; we use it to create societies. In itself, the law is neither "good" nor "bad;" rather, it can be used both to advance and undermine principles of justice. We are the ones who make those decisions. Our responsibility is to engage with this tool in thoughtful, deliberate, ethically driven ways to create the societies in which we aspire to live.